Public sentiment shows a nuanced perspective towards the Bar Council of India's new regulations regarding foreign law firms, oscillating between optimism about improved job opportunities and increased service quality, and skepticism about potential foreign dominance, issues of nepotism, and ethical degradation in the legal profession. While many celebrate reforms by the Chief Justice of India, others voice concerns over the impact on marginalized communities and the integrity of the legal system.

Bar Council of India

Foreign Law Firms

Chief Justice of India

Arbitrage consultant , field is nascent , law related but bound to grow , 100 💯 Percent.

[deleted]

Applying for UPSC on your 5th year is quite a big risk if you are not from a well off Family. You say you are 5th year then that means you took LLB when you were 17 or 19 years because 20 years is the age limit for 5 year LLB course. You must be 23 or 25 by now and my advice would be to pursue judicial profession like an Advocate. 

For example if you wish to be an Advocate Go and attempt **All India Bar Examination (AIBE)** after completing your degree.  

My point is get a stable state of income. Then go for UPSC if you want. UPSC is very tough and you might lose yourself while preparing for it. 

But if you don't have any money problems and are determined and parents are ready to support you, go for UPSC.

crystalcursed

Start practicing and simultaneously prepare for state judicial service.

Or state civil services with law as optional subject.

Hannah__Arendt

Hi, I'm also a law student and if it was me, I would probably try for government exams in your situation. There are exams for law officers in almost every department like Railways, RBI, Patent Office etc. The salary is decent, if nothing else. Please do look those up.

The other thing you can try is to work under a senior advocate and see if you like litigation while preparing for these exams, simultaneously.

Lastly, you can look at getting another degree to change your field of work. An MBA, would be quite suitable for this. I would say apply to foreign universities after 3-4 years of work experience if you can afford it. Otherwise, try your luck at CAT too.

patharmangsho

Don’t let fear of unknown to stop you. Whatever you do is unknown at first but then you master it. Daar k aage jeet hai.... so rather than thinking about unknown in these fields ... think about what you want to do and go for it.... with practicing law you will be able to make some money but it will also consume a lot of time... if you really want to do upsc and can afford to train for few more years, then go for it. Age is on you side

Turbulent_Simple_539

Sit, take and deap breath and picture yourself 10 15 years down the line in each profession, write pros and cons and decide the field in which you are interested.

901232856902

I'm not a barrister, but my first thought is that you'd need to look into whether you can get the right to work in the UK. Barristers are self employed so unlike solicitors I don't think skilled worker visas are an option.

jamesmatthews6

This from yesterday....

https://www.reddit.com/r/uklaw/s/I8M6AUaA5N

Additional-Fudge5068

As I understand it, India has foreign practice rules that make it very difficult for global firms to open satellite offices there, so they do most of their India-related work from Singapore or other Asian offices

Suitable-Internal-12

here is an article from May that describes the issues w/ international law firms opening offices in India: 

https://www.ft.com/content/de5c912c-65f9-46f8-bdee-0615fe4ac760

CreekHollow

India doesn’t allow foreign firms to operate there in any meaningful way. There was a somewhat embarrassing debacle earlier this year where they tried to and back tracked - the result of which is foreign law firms can now operate in India, but solely to advise foreign clients on foreign law. Why would a firm do that? Beats me. 

There’s probably a future where they amend the guidelines to allow foreign firms to advise Indian clients on foreign law from an Indian office. In that situation it might happen, and there will probably be some scope. The likelihood remains low though, so I wouldn’t get my hopes up.

Azuviel

India has very recently relaxed foreign practice rules but it remains to be seen whether and which biglaw firms will set up there. There is strong network of Indian firms (CAM, SAM, NDA, TL, AZB etc.) that can do Indian-related work cheaper than biglaw firms and have flourished back when foreign firms cannot practice in India and will be tough competition for biglaw firms willing to venture into India.

(Edited to change “cheaply” to “cheaper than biglaw firms”)

tetriscannoli

I think they’re loosening their rules regarding foreign firms being able to open offices. Which is good because finding decent India counsel for M&amp;A deals is a nightmare. Overwhelmingly they either need to be poked and prodded to do anything, or they mutilate agreements with inane details that don’t belong in US-style agreements. DLA or Baker McKenzie could make a killing just serving as local counsel on deals with an India component if they do open up the market.

Chance_Adhesiveness3

Maybe someday, but American lawyers are expensive and Mumbai local lawyers are really very good at what they do

randokomando

I think it’s mostly for Indian lawyers who already have experience and have an American LLM degree to go back to India and practice in the American firms in India

Dotfr

Indian regulations prevent foreign firms from practicing in india but some Indian firms in Delhi and Mumbai hire foreign qualified lawyers. I’m not 100% sure but I’m sure there is a major Indian law firm that has a NYC office

bhenchodland

It's highly unlikely even after the relaxation in rules. Indian corporate houses trust the likes of AZB, Khaitan, Amarchand etc. Any firm that opens up here will have to start from scratch in building trust. A lot of clients pay these firms due to their long standing relationship and trust they have built

AcrobaticCream8218

I think there are multiple factors at play before any US or international firm decides to open there. 

1. Even with the new “opening up” directives and guidelines, the landscape is likely to be heavily regulated for a few years as the government figures out how these changes impact the local market and its lawyers (whose rice bowl the government would want to protect).  

2. Lawyers from top Indian firms generally provide similar levels of service and work product at a much lower price compared to US firms (with some international and UK firms having a smaller price difference).  Additionally, it’ll probably always be the case that you go to Indian lawyers for local advice, especially when you’re doing a huge international deal or matter cutting across jurisdictions.  Conversely, Indian lawyers may not be able to effectively run a similar matter with touchpoints outside of the India (although a number now have Singapore offices). 

3. Many international firms have their “India-desk/practice” out of Singapore/Hong Kong/London where they already have offices.  Time difference is in some cases much easier to manage than let’s say NY/SF, and it’s easier to run any India-facing matter from those offices. 

That said, sometimes nothing beats showing you have a presence on the ground, although it has to be a meaningful presence.  Opening one office in Delhi/Mumbai or some other city may be symbolic but it probably won’t be enough to show the firm is serious about India.  A JV with a reputable Indian firm is more likely than not to make sense, but most US and international firms will probably take a wait and see approach.

Forsaken_Ad6935

The big problem with this is American lawyers cost an awful lot. Pricing them out of particular markets. Unless they are happy to make considerably less than their counterparts in other countries with the expectation to perform at the same standard.

This is why the Indian National firms hold the power, receiving referrals from multinational firms who don’t want to set up an office there.

BLM4442

From what I understand- India has its own system and has its own law firms. Including big law firms similar to what we have in the USA. I think entry might be difficult for those reasons alone. Then again- you never know! Maybe one day

Legal_Fitness

Being a first generation everything is hard. Except doctors, kyunki unki training main hi unki maar li jati hai.

Laudibhai

seeing this from my Law Office ka WiFi lol

trumpismexican

Because of the above stated reasons, i have invested 3 years of my life after ba llb and llm in preparing for judicial services exam. Still hoping to get through this mad competition else bhagwan bharose ✌️

Salt_Cantaloupe9940

I know 2 lawyers, one who isn't first generation, and the other who is first generation. And difference is insane. Always blows my mind. One still goes around on a scooty...the other just bought a penthouse. Lmao. Same goes for doctors. Have a friend who is struggling just because she is 1st gen, while some of her batchmates are traveling the world. Needless to say, it's all about building connections be it any profession.

boy_unrad

I relate so much. Law field is full of nepotism

dontmindmelol13

Also our great Bar Council expects lawyers to not take up any side business and continue to suffer on low practice earnings.

ShittyHuman1999

chamber me betha hu abhi. Bhai already itni gand phata hai future ka, tum aur phad rahe ho., but sacchai hai kya kare

VladamirTakin

I think judiciary in India has most nepotism after film industry and is followed by politics. I am surprised anyone without a family connection becomes a judge or gets promoted to high court.

zafar_bull

Koi na koi chahiyeeeeeeeeee guide karne wala

Dull-Wear-3286

Your social circle matters in the legal field. It's the foremost thing for building your practice or to get into their 1 firms or negotiating salaries for inhouse positions.

Crucial part is to figure out what you want to do within the field. For example, litigation. 

Firstly, it requires money to survive for initial couple of years, if you don't have then make it; secondly, a good chamber which again, through contacts and lastly, through with the procedure, drafting, research etc.

Now, comes the question of rewards of the struggle. Its more on the lines of becoming a Bollywood actor, bas ek movie aapko public ka hero bana deti hai but tab tak marwani padti hai. So, if you are in for that struggle, do enjoy it, otherwise, don't waste your youthful years in litigation.

10010000111100

Agreed. Very difficult but patience hard work and smart words can make it bit easy. I am too a first gen lawyer from UP, established my practise in Delhi. Initially it was really very tough but slowly and gradually things are falling in place. 
Just keep doing what you are good at, I know it's tough but be sure, you'll make it.
All the best!

abhidas0

Our judiciary is the worse than Bollywood when it comes to nepotism.

moab911

It was my first day of internship at the chambers of a senior adv. He was nice but he obv doesn't have time to instruct interns. The assoc were awful though! There was a palpable arrogance in the air. One of them was like how you’d imagine a quintessential Jindal graduate- snobby! 

I also happened to be a part of this non work-related discussion before I left. Got to know how fucking rich these assoc's are- they live in south/central Delhi, have chauffeurs and what not! I couldn't help but feel out of place lmao 

More than ranting about how hard litigation is- i wanna discuss how not to feel less when surrounded by affluent people because this is very common in law chambers/ firms. 

Ps- I am privileged- have parents jinke ghar pe rehti hun, they pay for my college fees and i prolly won't be homeless after i'm done w the course if I don't get a job. But the thought that my parents will have to bear more fin burden due to me is utterly terrifying.

zorskii

First gen hoke practice karne ka socha hai to yei hoga. Better hai corporate me job karo, paisa aur respect dono milenge. practice karni hai to ye RR jhelna hi padega.

Ok-Reference-6260

Unless you win the Genetic lottery everything is difficult!

fatmanbejones

the_greem_Umicorn

Ye post kei comments padh kar to depressed hogi mai.

This is so true!!! Being first generation lawyer and also getting you degree from tier 3 collage is even worse. No law firms would even acknowledge your CV let alone give you a chance. The civil and criminal litigation area is dominated and filled with uncles and their nephews/ sons. I thought doing LLM for good NLU would help secure a decent job, but people have burst that bubble also. Literally no clue how to move forward even though you love law you are not able to build satisfactory career in it. Sigh!

discipulus_iuris

Same goes for doctors too. MBBS is just a piece of paper unless you're dad is an established doctor.

MeTejaHu

Agreed I am a first gen doctor and still earning peanuts whereas my friends with doctor parents or families are earning more than well. For nepotistic fields it's often difficult. 

A conversation comes to my mind. I always thought law is a field based on connection s and I asked a young girl who was doing Law , how difficult it would be for her. Pat came the reply that her father has a lot of connections so she isn't worried. Came home to ask my mother and got to know that the short, stout, quiet uncle downstairs is actually a huge hotshot and her daughter had a field day selecting internship opportunities. 

I am in the same boat since 5 yrs and still things aren't that easy. So I want to say it will get better because I sincerely hope it does.

lollipop_laagelu

Try doing CA without any guidance, you'll feel better.

Aggressive_Eagle_235

Aur phir jab log bolte hai “beta judiciary krlo ladkion ke liye vahi accha hai” toh gussa bhi ata hai, dill bhi toot jata hai 
But deep down I know they’re right. 
Marne se pehle bc jisne mujhe law krne ke liye motivate kiya uske ghusand maarke daant zaroor todne hai.

billoraani

Any advice for a 1st year LLB student from DU.

deoid000

Bhai, I graduated in 2022, and I have been trying for corporate since 2023 and jab interview schedule. hua tha recently tab muje kaha gaya ki. You don't have enough experience of Non-Litigation. Litigation main Salary se kuch satisfaction nai hai aur na hi Mind se kuch satisfaction hai bus yaha vaha bhagna hai aur seniors ke opinions or views ko confront kiya to humiliation face karna hai

Rajj10

Its not just about lawyers, Its the same in almost all fields....sadly it is going to be an uphill battle since no one told you anything about it before. LOL  
just like no one asked you before being born into this world, you just did. LMAO  


"If you don't come from a rich family, then a rich family must come from you..."  


good luck.

Paragraph_Kumar

I did my undergrad from one of the alleged top tier law schools of India. I graduated a few years ago. I have been practising independently, and I have been doing pretty well, if I say so myself. I am also a first gen lawyer with no family contacts - so all who are losing hope, the future is not that bleak too.

Technically, being a first generation for *anything in India is difficult.

I come from very conservative family and the first one to dive outside my native town and join corporates, and believe me, I live in a society where a government peon gets more respect than my Privileged Consultant job

threeeyes94

Bhai aisa mat bol, main be first generation lawyer hu and abhi study chal rahe hai.. tu pehle se he depress kr reha hai

diamondthrust201

mne toh LLM ka socha tha but BALLB kr rkha h unknown se college se.. pata nahi aagey kya hoga.. smjh ni ara kuch

mokshadoes

There is a stupendous amount of law graduates churning out.. when there is virtually no demand for them. AFAIK the companies (specially banks) have drastically reduced the salaries of law officers/in house counsel because there are literally 1000s of candidates for a single vaccancy.

kenjicode96

Practicing law independently is difficult brother, if you have the merit you can try joining a firm or a well paying senior like Rajshekhar Rao. 
Also you don’t have to compare yourself with other nepo people, they have too many benefits that you don’t. If you are hard working, have a decent aptitude you’ll do better than 80 percent of lawyers. Keep grinding bro.

Thug69

I am currently in 11th preparing for JEE because of my father. I want to a lawyer but I am not sure if I should opt for it. my dad says that 1st gen lawyers do not have much luck they are exploited(mostly girls) and almost no salary.  I am not able to survive Allen but I have no problem studying PCM as it is of my interest as well. Should I go for law?

Perfect_Car_7452

I am about to start my law school in a few weeks. I am a first gen law aspirant. Reading all the comments made me wonder "What the hell have I signed up for?" I'd love to know whether the struggle gets worth it in the future

Local_Ocelot4579

Bhai as a first gen I think you would understand when I say this
Meri internship lagwade kissi corp law for mein

ObjectiveAd6612

Hi ! I hope things are better with you! I am a recent law graduate and have been struggling to find a job which could sustain me in Delhi. I am a first gen lawyer with no connections. I am very passionate to learn and grow. I have gained a little kickstart through some internships. It would be really helpful if you could help a fresher and a junior in building his career through mentoring. I am willing to share my CV, cover letter and also to connect over phone or mail for further communication.

Striking-Ad9138

Historical_Sound_751

...Welcome to life?   


Also, don't forget the pressure that goes along with being second or third generation. Not everything works out fine and you are constantly going to be compared to your parents no matter what.

AloneCan9661

Affectionate_Age_235

Worked with a Lawyer firm for years. The rumor goes that ,Sanjay Dutt had almost managed each and  everything at Bombay High Court . The verdict was out ,Judge had acquitted him of all the charges and the file was laying on some particular ground floor for 4 days.

Then arrived Ujwal Nikam ,who came to know about these rumored developments. He went helter-skelter throughout Bombay High Court,to get more news. Judge got scared  ,and reverted back the verdict.

---------

In Pune Court (Shivajinagar),if you don't bribe the peun after case gets over ,you are looked upon as a heartless bitch. 

----

Feminist Judge - Normally a woman judge ,who always gives verdict against men.

Most of the Judges(Atleast the ones I saw at Pune-Mumbai) are afraid to give death sentences ,they are normally like,"I don't want blood on my hands,lets leave it on gods!" 

Many Judges hold grudge against Police force,because they might have had bad experience about Police in past.

______
Criminal Lawyers - Some are affiliated with Gangs. Gangsters call these lawyers one day before they are gonna bump of rival gang member. Lawyer is given all info about place-time-name. Lawyers work is to visit (read manage) the police station of that area. 
________

Verdict Scehduled at 0400PM (Assume)

Lawyer gives 100bucks to Clerk to check if he has won the case. Clerk leaks the info 5-6 hrs before verdict.Say 1100hrs.

If Lawyer has won the case,he will give a call to client  : " Judge says will put verdict by our side if we pay 10lacs...shall I go ahead ??"

Cleint : Affirm ! Good Job ! I will send you the money in your account !

Lawyer : Do it right away...and dont forget my commission :D





___________

But most funny lawyer I had seen was this particular criminal lawyer ,who had rather strange strategy of extorting maximum fees from most dreaded criminals : 

Criminal : Sir...I committed one crime ...jhol !

Lawyer : What!!!! What did you do ??

Criminal : I beat up that fella with rod....

Lawyer : Bhenchod ! WTF ! Thats grave crime ! DEATH SENTENCE !!!!! YOU ARE DEAD MEAT !!!...TERI MAKI CHUTT TU TO GAYA !!!

Criminal : (Scared to death) ...sirr..sirr...what are you saying...what ...what :(....please do something...please I beg you...stop this...

Lawyer : OKOK...lemme see what I can do....50k before,50k later...fine by you ??

Criminal : Sir take 1lac in advance...but free me !

Lawyer :...OK...(Evil Smile) !


MeManoos

That there are different types of lawyers than the stereotyped image of the Indian lawyer who litigates in courts. Re-posting an earlier comment on the options for fresh law graduates (very generalized) :

1. **Betrayer of the Motherland (Grade I):** Top ranks from top colleges go to foreign law firms like Clifford Chance where you get fantastic pay and reasonable working hours. In most foreign firms you get a secretary to take care of all the admin work like billing, filing, etc;
2. **Betrayer of the Motherland (Grade II):** Top-ish ranks with a lot of publications go to foreign university to do an LLM and then become a Grade I Betrayer;
3. **Corporate Whore (Grade I):** Medium ranks from top colleges and top ranks from medium colleges go to the large corporate law firms. Good pay (starting at approx a lakh a month), but hours are really painful till you become a senior associate. If you grunt it out and make SA, hours will reduce but work will almost always remain stressfull. You'll have to do your share of admin work, but routine stuff is handled by shared secretaries. There will be some flexibility in hours, you work late - you can come in a bit late the next day. You also get to interact with the so called corporate elite, if that is your fetish.
4. **Corporate Whore (Grade II):** Smaller law firms mean the hours are almost as crap as Grade I whores but you also have to do a lot more admin work and worse, a lot of PR work (as few ppl know your firm). Smaller firms also mean bigger egos rubbing against each other and a lot of office politics. Oh, and the pay is not that great.
5. **Captive Corporate Whore:** You get into the legal department of a company like infosys, mahindra or hp. You have one client only - your company. Pay varies according to company, but you will mostly earn less than Grade I whores. Work is boring, but the advantage is that the work hours are easy and is highly recommended for lazy people. Work environment varies according to the size of the legal team. Work hours not flexible in some companies.
6. **Pauper:** The real world. You go old school style into litigation. Remain a pauper for a decade, saying nothing but "Plaintiff seeks adjournment" in courts and then depending on your abilitiy, you either sink into oblivion or rise into a proper big shot lawyer who gets a lakh for making a 5 minute appearance. A lot of top ranks choose this if they have the flair for litigation.
7. **Papa's Boy:** Litigation, but your dad/mom/relative is already a big shot judge/lawyer - so you are not a pauper and your rise is smoother and faster.
8. **Drone:** Join an LPO - Legal Process Outsourcing unit - paralegal work: legal research and data entry. Pay will be terrible and there wont be much respect from within the legal community.
9. **Sage:** You dont give a shit about the money or glory. Do more LLMs, MPhils, write more papers. Go into teaching, writing, research.

Chocolate_Horlicks

Like other professions (trader, doctor, engineer or military)  legal profession is a family profession in India. 

If you like to win a case, hire a relative of judge (son-inlay, daughter-in-law, nephew etc.) for consultation or for other services. It is a legal way to bribe.



http://pib.nic.in/newsite/erelease.aspx?relid=89251

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2010/20101129/main3.htm

http://www.frontline.in/static/html/fl2801/stories/20110114280103900.htm

rajsin

Alright, listen to this.

I'm no lawyer, but an Indian citizen forced to be a *pro se* litigant, or as understood in Indian legal circles-&gt;Self-represented Party.

I have been witnessing the workings of our legal system for a while now, and have picked up the following.

Always ask for a receipt from your lawyer. Without proof in the form of paperwork, the Bar Council gives weightage to the Lawyer's verbal denial of wrongdoing. For a lawyer to get a clean chit by the Bar Association, he only needs to present himself and deny the charges. For a lawyer to get a clean chit from the Bar Council, he only needs to provide written defence statement denying all the charges. There is no trial. No facility to examine evidence. There is no valid avenue to hold these lawyers accountable. This is why they're resorting to all forms of treachery, both financial &amp; criminal.

Another fun fact: To lodge a complaint against any lawyer with the Bar Council you need to pay up Rs. 1000 [where I live]. You should also provide them with 30 copies of your complaint. Odds are stacked against the complainant at every level.

In the courtroom,

...what you see as delay is mostly an abuse of Procedural Law, which is the law of process. In the Hindu article, where it says that lawyers show up unprepared, they cite some ineffective excuse to get a new date posting. You guys have to understand that as long as the case exists at the court, the lawyer has a guaranteed mode of income. If an aware citizen as myself begins to question the process and status, the lawyers will refuse to litigate on your behalf. They prefer clients who will stay in the dark and cough up money to finance their abuse of Procedural Law.

My recommendation is that we should all become Self-represented parties as a form of protest and fight for an independent organisation to monitor crimes by lawyers. 

It is not that hard to litigate on your behalf, get a textbook and teach yourself about the various stages of litigation...trust me, you guys are way more qualified than those idiots in black coats who barely understand English. Good luck!

pro_se_litigant

I have an acquaintance who gave 15 lakhs for the post Additional District Magistrate , he was asked for it directly during the interviews .

The extrapolation is tragically obvious. 

I'm not a lawyer but know enough about the legal system in this country.

Judges &amp; judgments are sold to the highest bidder. 

desi_dybuk

READ ABOUT UNSCRUPULOUS LAWYERS AND CORRUPT JUDGES OF INDIA

u/A 227 file 2343 of 2023, in the High Court of Allahabad, by Padia J.

In the District Court of Prayagraj file 2890/2017, by Sajid, Smt. K. Kishore JJ.

In Tehsil Handia, Prayagraj, case of NRI Ramesh Mishra,

Frivolous proceeding the judges are knowingly continuing based upon the forged affidavits of my younger brother mentally of unsound mind for the financial gain.

Aggravating_Two_5843

The Bar Council of India is creating a registry for law firms, allowing foreign lawyers to enter non-litigious practice areas, raising regulatory concerns.

Bar Council of India and Foreign Law Firms

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