Public sentiment is deeply polarized and predominantly negative regarding the potential for effective Russia-US negotiations amid ongoing conflict in Ukraine. Many commenters express skepticism about Trump's ability to negotiate peace, harshly criticize US foreign policy, and show support for alternative global powers like Russia and China. A pervasive sense of distrust towards both leaders and the potential superficiality of talks reflects widespread frustration and a yearning for real progress towards peace.

Russia

Trump

Ukraine

For some reason people often ask these types of questions to Ukrainians, and I don't understand why. It's like Lex Friedman asked Zelenskyy if he'll ever be able to forgive russians. The question that pops in my mind when I hear this is — do they ask for forgiveness? Do they regret what happened? Doesn't seem like it. Most of them love the fact that they stole some land from a neighbor and projected some power on the world stage. So to answer your question, it depends on russians. If they repent German-style, give us our land back and pay reparations, then it will be possible to restore good relations. But I highly doubt this will happen unless they're defeated. So until then my priority is to make sure my kids don't know the russian language as I, unfortunately, do.

CEOofBavowna

Nothing. It will be as it is now for a very long time. Not neutral or positive - only strongly negative. 

Salt_Bookkeeper_8201

How is the quote?

Never forget, never to forgive.

Parallels with WW2 and Germany don't really work because Germany was defeated, brought to its knees, and while not perfect, denazified. Germans were (some still are to this day) apologetic for their past crimes and they mean it.

I can't really see this happening with ruSSia as much as I wish otherwise.

kalfas071

Russia (or its equivalent through history) has been trying to genocide us for the last 300+ years
This time, they just went waayyy too far and it's unfixable 

Ukraine has been more than patient with these mf 
So yeah, some sort of cold war seems realistic
Or just...no contact or strict minimum of contact
Unfortunately we need a gaz source and idk if Ukraine will find one that doesn't use the pipelines
But it's better if Ukraine stays "far" from Russia and stays ready to retaliate any time again in the future

MySecretLife15

Not Ukrainian, but from another country invaded by Russia (ww1-2 basically). Eastern Europe. Grandfather fought them, even faced time in the gulag. 

Grandparents disliked them too. 

The more you hear about them and the more you interact with them online, it makes you dislike them more. 

Always had a very bad opinion on them. So even after 4 generations, it did not pass. 

Sadly, the 6-7th generation got their brain fried by Tik Tok and pulls again to them.

ColdZal

Ireland had a similar issue with its neighbour wanting to control, dominate and invade for hundreds of years. They even brought their own people in and forcibly took land off the native Irish.
The end result is generations of resentment but it is definitely getting a lot better in Ireland in the last 30 odd years

joemc1972

With a normal country, maybe 10-15 years could bring some level of normalcy. With Russia no. It's a country that could never suppress its domineering, aggressive attitude towards everybody.

cobaltcolander

There would not be "after war" as long as Russia exists.

Repulsive_Still_731

We will hate them forever and nothing will change that. Even if at some point ruzia gives us back all our lands, we will never stop considering ruzia as our number one threat. There is a small chance that our relationship with the russians could change if ruzia ceases to exist in its current form and breaks up into dozens of new entities. In that case, we may reconsider our relations with certain entities of the former ruzian federation.

[deleted]

We have an example of WW2 and Germany. We all remember how Willy Brandt kneeled before a memorial to the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising. And other not so symbolic but more practical moves of Germany and German people. How they condemned all the crimes and genocides they committed, went through Nürnberg trials and don't even think about glorifying this part of their history.

Can russians reflect their crimes on the same level? I have huge doubts. They won't do it even partially. My bet is they will lay putin in mausoleum next to lenin's mummy and will continue jerking on their imperialistic ambitions with new attempts to invade us. Especially if they will be allowed to stay on occupied lands. And as we can see westerners are happy to make sure that russians will stay

inokentii

Imagine you live in the countryside. Your neighbor killed your brother and raped your daughter. Your son and his wife fled to another country because of this and you will never see them, nor will you see your grandchildren. Your neighbor also took your land and destroyed your house. You are left alone with your elderly parents, in a couple of surviving rooms. One of your parents is not friendly with their head and thinks your neighbor did good and you deserve it.

The police tell you it's time to end it, it's your own fault. A peace between you and the neighbor here and now.

This is roughly how you can imagine how Ukrainians feel.

Dragomir3777

I expect to have no relations with them. In my dream scenario they will not exist as a big country.

JonSnow240792

there are no prospects for any favorable outcomes. undoubtedly, russian propaganda will persist in spreading anti-Ukrainian narratives, and as conditions worsen in russia (which is an unavoidable result of a violent and senseless aggressive war), russians will hold Ukraine accountable for all their woes and the state apparatus will endorse this perspective in every conceivable manner. without acknowledgment of errors and restitution for harm from the aggressor, no genuine reconciliation is clearly achievable, thus we will not witness any enhancement in these relations in the coming decades.

vsovietov

I hope that this time, when everything is over, Ukraine will destroy all the large direct roads to russia and replace them with parallel ones (like in Finland). And also make the entire border area impassable and mine it entirely (wet dreams but I want it to be this way, there should be no trust/carelessness anymore)

FoMotherVodka

It's going to require for sure time and committment. Like Germany and the rest after WWII: commitment to become a peaceful democracy from Russia and time for Ukraine to forgive (id they want to; It's not Russia's call)

GothYagamy

The same way South Korea has relations with North Korea now.

PlasmaMatus

I grew up with not so great view of them already. Remember this is not the first time they have started stuff with Ukraine. From Ukrainisation to the forced famine to czarist russia. The west is only paying attention now.

I have no idea how this ended up on my thread, as I am not Ukrainian.

Everyone saying Nazi Germany is looking at the wrong Axis power. They should be looking more towards Imperial Japan, who did worse than the Nazis and the Russians are currently doing.

Relations with Korea and China are/were still stranded as a result. But there are economic links, Japanese pop culture is strong through things like anime, sushi, etc.

But normalization took a lot longer than in Europe. I imagine Ukraine and Russia will take a similar path. You'll probably have economic ties, but still never fully trust nor forgive the Russians.

Revivaled-Jam849

Look, i'm going to be blunt with you, and although i don't have a ukrainian passport, i have a mixed Ethnicity, of Ukrainian and Lithuanian.

What is there to forgive to a country that has habitually not learned from its history? Because Ukraine isn't the first or second time that Russia has been doing it.

As for ruSSians, it's a complete delusion. I'm normally very generous toward russians, by saying that they might be politically indifferent, instead of fascist in nature (for a good chunk of the country, which is roughly 48-50%). Russia has never been a friend of eastern AND central europe, and never will be.

Flimsy-Chapter3023

Hopefully "Russia" stops existing. Only then can Ukraine and the rest of the world start to repair relations with the new smaller nations Russia will be broken down into. Even then it'll take several generations.

Foreverett

I would expect to have zero relations with them embargo of trade and investments, roads cut off, border mined to oblivion and river style moat with barbwires along the borders.

Mikk_UA_

There might not be a Russia after the war  

Russia is not really a country. It is the cities of Moscow and St. Petersburg, and then a bunch of loosely confederated lands and peoples. It has many enemies, external and internal. I believe the war will end with Putin's death, naturally or otherwise. Whoever comes after might not be able to keep the country together.

TheHolyReality

There won't be russia anymore when this ends

Specialist_No_Limits

My wife is Ukrainian. She hates russia with every fiber of her being . So does the rest of her family. Her friends. Their families. Their friends. All of them are still in Ukraine. She disowned a friend of hers who happened to be working in muscovy when the war started who was like a sister to her. 


There will never be any sort of friendly ties ever again for a lot of Ukrainians.

Fun-Distribution-159

These kind of questions are deranged AF it makes me mad. Like if someone stole your car killed your dog, filmed it, ridiculed and openly enjoyed the suffering of poor animal, and after paying 15$ fine and couple bruises from you is overall happy with how it all went. Bragging and laughing in your face. How would you feel? Would it suddenly be normal after some douche  sheriff will say your conflict is over?
Now extrapolate this to your family members, kids, friends, their futures.

zavorad

When dealing with Russians, it's good to keep in mind the phrase: "The tree remembers, but the axe forgets"

I can't compare what we Finns are going through to what the Ukrainians are going through, but if I can't see a normalization of relations between us and the Russians in decades, it's even harder to imagine such between the Ukrainians and the Russians.

BigLupu

I am going to continue to tell my Russian friends who go back to visit their families to fuck off

Bitter_Firefighter_1

Nothing more than breadlines and begging for forgiveness.

luv2fly781


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eliorkl1

It would actually depend on the end of the war. If it ends with Russia controlling parts of Ukraine, while the ukrainan government could accept it, there would be splinter cells and regional instability for years to come. Possibly revolts and all the "nice" things that come with it.

If it ends with Ukraines best case, Russia pulls back entirely, then a few decades before things resume as usual.

Ofcourse in any situation it would depend on the antagonism of both sides.

LibrarianJesus

*There will be Dragons...*

I mean - there will be no any relations for next 2-3 generations. Closed borders, strong disagree in any part of discussions, decline of speaking, understanding and listening.

You picture of war end is complete misleading roots of this conflict. There will be no any end till one of sides will not be crushed - either Russia or Ukraine.

elhsmart

True-Machine-823

Kinda like asking what will the relations be with germany at the end of the war in 1939

Additional_Ad_8131

I'm in the UK not Ukraine.  But, they have committed acts of war against us.  Used WMDS on our soil, they have sunk some boats in our waters, disrupted trade, hacked our computers, meddled in elections and threatened even to nuke us

There is not a lot of love for Russia.  And until Russia undergoes major regime change, and becomes a true, peaceful democratic nation, that won't change 

We have no beef with *the people* living in Russia, only for the support for a regime that actively publicises the fact that it wants us all dead

I can only imagine how much more hate for Russia the Ukrainian people must have

madoggi

Depends on how the war ends and what Russians do. For now we see no remorse, no self-condemnation, no step is taken into recognition of Russian crimes by Russians. They either support the war or try to distance themselves from it, to avoid collective responsibility. I don’t see it changing in near future and there’s no chance for relationship between the countries.

Injuredmind

Here’s the photo of an old woman from Sumy burying her son, grandson and daughter in law. I hope every Ukrainian thinks about her or thousands of others before thinking of normalising relationships with russia. https://www.instagram.com/p/DIiifKSIi98/?igsh=aGd4cXZqOG9jZ3Fs

I will hate russians as long as I live, and if I ever hate kids I’ll make sure they hate anything russian too. 

lesiashelby

Funny you should mention Korea, because the occupation of Korea by Japan from 1910-1945 is still fresh in the minds of every single Korean citizen (both North and South). The animosity toward Japan is real and it isn't going away anytime soon despite South Korea and Japan being geopolitical allies and trading partners.

I imagine that Ukrainians will hate Russians for generations going forward, no matter what the results of the war will be.

TenchuReddit

What would be Poland's relations with Germany after ww2? Hatered, deserved hatered and that's it. The russians are scum like the nazis.

pillowname

They’ll only become friendly with each other once there’s a change in government that’s friendly to Ukraine.

Medical-Nobody-6462

Corren_64

Well, historical example - Turks/Ottoman Empire has been conquering and killing countries on the Balkans for \~5 centuries, but now we are pretty much OK.

jvproton

Europe will go back to business following Trump.

Ukraine will be in a frozen territorial conflict like Cyprus but probably without a prospect for return of the territory.
Rebuilding will be a big job, foreign capital can help but it will take years to return to prewar economy.

EU states around Russia will keep upping the defence spend at least for a decade.

Relations will hopefully slowly normalise.

0xPianist

eggpotion

It's either Belarus or Lithuania. There's nothing in between, that's the sad reality determined by its geography.

porkbelly2022

Depends on how this war ends.

There could be a korean situation wich in my opinion is the most likly scenario. 

If russia fully occupies ukraine it will be the same like poland or hungary under the communists, where there is a 50/50 chance that People after some years will have better or worse views of russia.

If ukraine manages to take back its territories, it depends on the inner political situation of russia, they could go full revanzist like germany in the 30s or Reform there goverment and say sorry for there actions like germany under Brandt, or they could favor the Status qou where whe have the same scenario as china and Japan, where there are economic thies, but hatred among the People. 

The most interisting aspect will be the younger Generations, i myself am an russian german and talked with many ukrainians and russians in germany,  yes there are nationalistic People who will never accept the other side but there are also many People who had family and friends from both countries prior to the war, this People normaly hate politics especially from russia but get along with normal People wich are not politically active, so there is potential for better relations in the far future but not directly after the war but maby in 20 or 30 years.

Agrull

Many Ukrainians understand that Russians really have little choice, and there is a significant number of people who are not pro Putin.

It will depend on the individual and circumstance.

Queasy_Badger9252

Logic dictates a strong hatred for anyone who was alive during this time for the rest of their lives. There will be a slow falloff of hostility with each generation after that.  
When you hear of evil people doing awful things to your parents you hate them but if it happened to your great-great-grandparents it is less hard to be emotionally effected.

Low_Engineering_3301

I imagine quite negative, for quite a while.

I mean, they will keep finding corpses and mass graves, for decades. And people will keep stepping on landmines and finding unexploded ordinance, again for years if not decades, which won't help. The damage to environment and pollution in the area will be massive and long-lasting. Damage to settlements and infrastructure is again going to take decades to repair. And most importantly, even if Russian troops pull out, they won't go far, that threat is going to be omnipresent. So that will very much change the mentality of the people overall.

No going back after this, I don't think. Not for a couple of generations at least. It's fixable, nothing lasts forever, but the damage has been pretty catastrophic, so it'll be a while. And it's quite possible that there's going to be just fundamental long-lasting shift in perception that goes on for centuries.

Sabbathius

This would depend a lot on how the conflict ends.

If there's a 'deal', I can't see how it would be calm, normal and happy  relations.

I think if Putin died or is removed &amp; the war stops as a result, the relations might eventualy be normalised.

But there's likely to be another similar nationalist figure waiting to step in.

westcoast5556

Over 70% of Ukrainians openly support Bandera since the 2022 invasion. That’s a Pandora’s Box that ain’t ever getting closed.

Fuck_this_timeline

Relations with Russia will be the same as they are with any lying, violent, alkoholic who survives by robbing people and stealing from its neighbours and friends.

kamden096

It’s impossible to even start to predict the post war relationship until we know how and under what circumstances the war eventually ends

Potential-Daikon-970

Crazy-Donkey8565

watching_whatever

It mostly depends on how the war ends; but what do you mean "after the war ends" if "a Korean-style frozen conflict" is somehow "after the war"? The Korean War has not concluded; there's only a ceasefire. That's why they have all those fortifications. That's not the end of the war. The war ended for US, but not for Koreans. But in Ukraine there are no US troops, so Korean-like ceasefire would not mean the end of the war for anyone.

This_Growth2898

Ukraine will join NATO and the European Union.

playbigg

Germany and USA with Trump will kiss Putins ass as always.

Trax-d

Repulsive_Drag_8406

Modern day Ukraine (1991 borders) wouldn't exist in a decade or so.
The part that will left with the Europe will be integrated in their institutions and will have terrible relationship with Russia (like India - Pakistan).
Occupied part of Ukraine will be integrated into Russia and will be just another region of Russia, like modern day Crimea.

Nothing good though.

izoiva

Could be bad , neutral or positive, depending on the resolution. Many terrible conflicts ended fairly positive like on the top of my head, Germany and the rest of Europe, South Africa and the UK, US and Vietnam. Granted I can also give you examples of the opposite.

Other-Comfortable-64

Handshakes and business as usual. 

Extremists or patriots depends on how you see them will start plotting bomb attacks and assassinations. 

Political tension within Ukraine while maintaining uneasy relations with Russia. It is not going to be easy as a Ukrainian president after the war.

Lazy-Sugar-3888

It will be almost identical to Bosnia -Herzegovina where the US forced an unjust peace. Russia will act as Serbia.

They will use the Russian dominated provinces to destabilise Ukraine and to meddle in internal politics of Ukraine.  The threat of another was will be used to try and get Ukraine to submit to the will of Russia…

vegabondsal

Putin's speech at the Munich security conference in 2007 is usually seen as one of the key milestones

LivingAsparagus91

Yes in definitely sure calling Russia a petrol station with Nuke was a great show on how he wanted to reset relationship

Myself-io

Who isn't? After USSR collapsed, the Russian government genuinely thought that the US would treat it as an equal and would be a fair partner. Then the first NATO expansions came, and already the Russian government voiced concerns - even Gorbachev, so despised in Russia for his pro-American views, [spoke negatively](https://youtu.be/3wB9uL2lKaw) about this to the US Congress. 

Then the bombings of Yugoslavia took place. And even the Yeltsin government, much derided for their seeming kowtowing to Americans, started to take a very cautious stance. Primakov turned his plane around when hearing of this, cancelling a diplomatic visit to the US. The Russian military mission in Yugoslavia nearly got to blows with NATO forces, and through Yeltsin government's diplomatic efforts managed to get its own authority equal and separate from NATO's in the peacekeeping efforts. And this was the most pro-US government we had. 

And then the US unilaterally leaves the ABM treaty in 2001. The Russian government warns against this, insisting that it will revive a nuclear arms race, that it's an unnecessary, destabilizing move. That a better alternative would be to seek to include China and other nascent nuclear powers in the treaty. The US ignores this. 

So with that, in the 10 years after the collapse of USSR, the illusions were completely broken. Whatever peaceful relations you may think there were, the Russian government never forgot these things, especially when other waves of NATO expansion came as reminders. 

So if you really want to know who's responsible, look at the American officials throughout the 90s. The ones that advocated for all these expansionist moves, the ones that [suggested the bombing of Belgrade](https://youtu.be/vei_18YcC6E), the dissolution of the hard-won Cold War nuclear security agreements. They're the ones that spit in the face of cooperation, in favour of domination and hegemony.

Dawidko1200

marked01

US. Russia used to be a very pro-western country, but was welcomed by the US and EU only while it was staying silent.

cray_psu

Poland. And the Baltics.

The US politics is rather straightforward. American politicians don't think steps ahead.

For Poland and the Baltics the "Russia scare" became a primary point of foreign politics, and they promoted it, keeping saying that they needed investments to be protected from Russia. They were showing full loyalty to the US. The US liked this and approved this. At the time this US-Poland axis was seen as a tool for Americans' control over Europe, against the influence 'old Europe' (France and Germany). It created a situation where nobody in Russia was thinking about any anti-American policies, while US policy in Eastern Europe relied heavily on local russophobic rhetoric.

Then there was Ukraine with its two Western-backed coups, where the usurpers were both russophobic and showing off loyalty the US, which instantly made them liked by American politicians. That was the point of no return.

Hellerick_V

&gt; reset

It's just an empty buzzword. What were the interests (economic\geopolitical) of US and Russia? US still wanted us to be a helpless mess without any interests and sovereignty, and our ruling class wanted at least a tiiiiiny little bit of sovereignty - that's why the "deterioration". Irreconcilable conflict of interests.

There were never any intentions to "reset" anything - it was just a narrative for plebs.

Pallid85

Bill Clinton?

&gt;According to the US, in 2012 Putin damaged relations by accusing the US of election interference,

Isn't it other way around, US damaged relations by interfering in russian elections? How you damage relations by accusing someone?

&gt;damaged relations further in 2014 by annexing Crimea and starting the war in Ukraine, ultimately leading to the failure of the reset.

Megathread rule.

Final_Account_5597

It all started with Saakashvili, who was very passionate about uniting Georgia. After success with Adjara (not without help of RF diplomats), he was keen to join South Osetia. This eventually lead to Russo-Georgian conflict and further decline RF-West in relationship.

Leading_Zebra_1441

US policy after the collapse of the USSR was to maintain its role as the only superpower in the world. This means that any large country that gains influence automatically becomes their enemy. The same applies even more to China, although China has never fought a war with the US or harmed it in any way, I constantly see Americans seriously discussing the need for a war with China simply to prevent this country from taking over their leadership. Americans do not accept equal relations with other countries, only subordination.

The one who made mistake on that 'reset' button they've gifted to Lavrov and labeled it 'overload' in Russian.

Maybe it is Brzezinski's legacy. Or Soros.

fan_is_ready

&gt; Who was responsible for the deterioration in US-Russia relations?

Western bloc. Not just USA, but entire bloc. There was a lot of goodwill towards the west in 1990s, and there was an opportunity. The opportunity was squandered, by western powers. 

My personal impression that when USSR collapsed western countries got a bit too happy, misunderstood the situation, and drank a bit too much cool aid. "The end of history", "We've won". Then they decided that they've built the best political system ever and, like USSR initially wanted, decided to bring the light to the rest of the globe whether people there liked the idea or not. 

That resulted in series of failed "interventions" in foreign countries.

Vladimir Putin warned not to touch Georgia or Ukraine back in 2008, on Bucharest summit. Gorbachev likely expected them to uphold non-expansion promise. That did not happen, and that led us to where we are all now.

NaN-183648

From the point of view of the US, it's obviously Russia. It's just the US external policy is about telling every single country what they should do and once they do not abide they become 'not democratic enough'. Hence, since Russia moved past the 'democratic' 90s and started to act more and more sovereign, the US started to like Russia less and less.

No, I don't agree with the US not willing to talk with others as equals.

Mischail

Reset was a play. It ment simply "this is your last chance, Russia, step aside and bow,l". If ever USA wanted to start a new relations, it have to learn how to respect other side.
Thou, thats a fantasy.

&gt;Do you agree with the Western narrative?

No.

&gt;Do you think the Russian government or the US government was responsible for the failure of the reset?

Both governments; though failure of reset is "natural", so it would cost an immensive efforts not to fail.

Facensearo

Malcolm_the_jester

Impressive_Glove_190

One can say this about the "Obama' reset": it's hard to change something without changing anything, but I tried to do it.

daktorkot

US appointed McFail as an ambassador, who did everything in his power to destroy any good relations left. John Sullivan wasn't much better.

Living_flame

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I think the U.S., particularly Trump and especially Elon Musk REALLY want those minerals. That’s why they all are outraged about Zelensky but still keep talking about the mineral deal. Not to be cynical, but I don’t buy that, “I don’t care what happens to Ukraine one way or another,” JD Vance all of a sudden is heartbroken about Ukrainians, that’s just not how this administration operates. They see that the war costs money and they want to make money instead. They see that Ukraine is weak and they can squeeze out quite a bit out of Ukraine right now. 

From an “America first” perspective it makes sense. The U.S. gets hundreds of billions of dollars in minerals without having to commit anything to Ukrainian security, Trump can be the “peacemaker,” the U.S. can normalize relations with Russia and cooperate economically. Maybe even squeeze out of Europe something as they’ll be terrified about Russia and the U.S. being in friendly relations and will probably be trying everything to please Trump. Taking geopolitical consequences out of the equation, it really is a win-win-win.

Hot_Instruction_5318

This is a proxy war between the US and Russia. The reality is Ukraine is a small fish in a very very big pond right now.

ImmortalPoseidon

How could we not be in the middle of these negotiations? Zelenskyy has already stated they cannot win this war without US funding. Biden is no longer president, and Trump wants to stop throwing money at the problem and find a way to end it. There is no scenario where the US isn’t a main player in any kind of negotiation.

likeabuddha

Thank you! Let's just walk away and let Ukraine, Russia, and Europe sort it out themselves.

Gaxxz

Why does ukraine and the EU keep asking america for security guarantee's?

G0TouchGrass420

I’m going to be blunt and say that you have not thought this question through. US and EU are paying to keep Ukraine afloat. Thus, US and/or EU are the ones having negotiations with Russia. Then it will be either Russia that declines the ceasefire deal or Ukraine that declines the ceasefire deal. Then US and EU will decide what to do next when that time comes.

closing-the-thread

The US should absolutely help host peace talks between warring states as a neutral third party. 

The issue here is that we are not neutral and are trying to find a benefit for us.

TheGoldStandard35

Trump wants to end the war. Simple as that. It is clear that neither Putin nor Zelinsky have any interest in stopping it.

StedeBonnet1

Yes the true non interventionist position is just leaving the conflict. Heck, the continent.

ILoveMcKenna777

Every peace negotiation ever has had a somewhat neutral arbiter to proside over the negotiations, for the us revolution it was France, for ww2 it was it Switzerland

Gsomethepatient

We're already invovled because we've been funding the war since before it started, and nobody would be happy if we just stopped funding it. Since we're already invovled, it just makes sense to try and end the killing.

soulwind42

Because the US is the global hegemon and the world superpower. America alone as the global empire decides what happens

EsotericMysticism2

Because we allow the war to continue with our aid…

219MSP

Chinese President Xi Jinping has expressed support for improved relations between Russia and the United States, coinciding with planned talks between Presidents Putin and Trump to address the ongoing war in Ukraine.

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