Public sentiment is largely negative, marked by frustration over the perceived misuse of gubernatorial power and the judicial system's inefficiency. Many express concerns that governors act politically to undermine democratic will, particularly in opposition-led states, calling for urgent reforms and accountability.

Governors

Judiciary

This is THE election the KS GOP is salivating over. They want as little press and public recognition as they can get.

It's a time bomb and they know it. 

it's not as "sexy" as the abortion election, but the KSDems should be pushing just as hard to shut it down. 

So of course, the KSDems won't do shit.

Vio_

willywalloo

The real ballot initiative should be to eliminate sneaky dishonest bills like this. This will only create a system in which wealthy donors can put their judges on the bench and the court will turn into constant campaigning like the rest of our politics has become.

Honky_Stonk_Man

I agree. The current system has saved Kansas from extremist justices regardless of appointments by Republican or Democratic governors. Having elected justices will invariably lead to the fuckery we all saw in Wisconsin last October and November with competing billionaires, Soros and Musk, essentially vying to purchase a pivotal state Supreme Court seat. 

Fuck that noise. That wasn’t good for Wisconsin and it wouldn’t be good for Kansas. This proposed amendment gets a hard no from me.

ksdanj

I think the opposition can rally against this by emphasizing that this would politicize the courts. Vote YES means politicizing the courts and forcing judges to run campaigns and have more political ads and everything while voting NO lets them just keep doing their job as experts

M3333

Not a good thing. It inevitably means "Justice Kobach."

lethargicbureaucrat

It will be important next summer when the information will be fresh before the vote to really publicize how our current system works and how the proposed bill would work if passed. 

Voting No for SB1611 will keep the Kansas Supreme Court Nominating Commission
unchanged. This is how our current system works. 

Appointment Process for Kansas Supreme Court Judges
Selection Method

Assisted Appointment: 

Justices are selected through a merit-based process involving the Kansas Supreme Court Nominating Commission.

Nominating Commission

Composition: The commission consists of nine members:

Four lawyers elected by their peers.

Four non-lawyers appointed by the governor.

One lawyer who serves as the chairperson, elected statewide.

Steps in the Appointment Process

Vacancy Occurs: When a vacancy arises, the commission reviews applications from candidates.

Nomination: The commission conducts public interviews and narrows the candidates to three nominees.

Governor's Selection: The governor selects one nominee from the list provided by the commission.

Retention Vote: After serving at least one year, the justice must stand for a retention vote in the next general election. 
If retained, they serve a six-year term.

Eligibility Requirements

Must be at least 30 years old.

Must have at least 10 years of active law practice in Kansas.
Must be a licensed attorney in the state.
This process ensures that justices are selected based on merit and qualifications, promoting a fair judicial system in Kansas.


Voting Yes for SB1611 will amend sections 5, 8 and 15 of article 3 of the
constitution of the state of Kansas; relating to the supreme court;
providing for direct election of justices; abolishing the supreme court nominating commission; permitting justices to make contributions to and hold office in a political party or organization
and take part in political campaigns.

Selection of justices of the supreme court. 

The citizens of Kansas who are qualified electors shall elect the justices of the supreme court. 
The rules applicable for such elections and the designation of position numbers shall be provided by law. 

Justice positions 1, 2 and 3 shall be elected at the general election in November of 2028, justice positions
4 and 5 in November of 2030 and justice positions 6 and 7 in November of 2032, and every six years thereafter, respectively. Any vacancy occurring on the supreme court for an unexpired term shall be filled by election as provided by
law.

A couple of notable points between the two choices:

In the current process, Kansas voters get to elect one lawyer who serves as chairperson for the committee, and after the first year of appointment the justice must stand for a retention vote. Kansas voters get to vote on whether or not they want to retain the justice appointment, if retained then the justice serves a 6 year term. 

If changed Kansas voters get only one vote for candidates at the time of the election, with the winner being appointed to a 6 year term. 

Kansans will have to decide do we want to vote to have qualified people that interview and vet candidates to recommend to our governor for the initial appointment in which Kansas voters get to decide after 12 months on the job if the Justice gets to retain their seat for a full term. 

Or do Kansans want to take it upon themselves and have faith in other Kansans to do the work and time it takes to make an informed decision on what candidate is best qualified for the position. 

If the committee and government get it wrong then we the people can remedy it the next year, if the people get it wrong we have to wait 6 years to try to fix it.

Euphoric-Departure20

In this field, I have seen some horribly unqualified people do the fundraising and baby-kissing tour and actually get elected to the position. I compare that process to merit selection from mainly people in the field, but they usually try to include community members in these selection boards. Ive seen much less complaints after these people have some time in the position if they were selected based on merit by people in the field.The nice thing is that the people on these boards selecting applicsnts based on merit are usually influential in their communities. Prominent local attorneys that keep getting work because the people think they are competent enough, judges who survive retention votes, etc. And they have much more information to go off of when making their selections. They also have a vested interest in picking the best candidate due to a hit to their crrdibility if they dont. 

But if the republicans want to encourage direct democracy and voting on issues by citizens instead of representatives, i hope to hear about them trying to wind down the electoral college any day now.

deadbabymammal

&gt;*”This is as important to all of us as "Protect Them Both" was.”*

The publicity in favor of this amendment will be just as loud and pervasive as *Value Them Both* was, too.

o-lay-tha

Anywhere I can buy a vote no on sb1611 sign? Kinda fucked up and would like to get the information out.

mrsmiley32

The entire bar, left and right, appear to be against this.

kategoad

deepstaterecords

Powerful_Edge666


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*"It’s uncanny."*

"When Thomas Jefferson was writing the Declaration of Independence in the weeks leading up July 4, 1776, he wanted to not only rely on just high-falutin enlightenment ideals to justify the case for separation from Great Britain. His aim was also to present a slam-dunk indictment of King George III—to prove that the royal was a “tyrant” and that he and Parliament had forfeited their right to rule the Americans by breaking their own laws and trampling on the rights of their people. This is why about half of the Declaration is a list of 27 specific grievances lodged against the King and his regime."

"Two hundred and forty-nine years later, many of these grievances apply to the reign of Donald Trump. Here’s a look at how Trump stacks up against the Mad King."

*He has endeavored to prevent the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither, and raising the conditions of new Appropriations of Lands.*

"Trump has revealed a plan [to denaturalize](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/jun/30/trump-birthright-citizenship-naturalized-citizens) certain American citizens. He has [imposed a new ban](https://apnews.com/article/trump-travel-ban-immigration-enforcement-visas-b1eb79c7b5717c96daf51e978db83d1b) on migration from many nations and [undone the immigration status](https://www.ilrc.org/press-room/another-inhumane-trump-decision-ending-temporary-protected-status-haitians) of hundreds of thousands of people legally living in the United States. Basically, he has been attempting to keep out people out—especially from nations he calls “shithole countries.” His administration has also taken steps to block foreign students from attending American colleges and universities."

*He has obstructed the Administration of Justice, by refusing his Assent to Laws for establishing Judiciary powers.*

"For his final report, special counsel Robert Mueller produced a [187-page volume](https://www.justice.gov/storage/report_volume2.pdf) detailing Trump’s efforts to obstruct justice during the Russia investigation. More recently, the Trump administration has faced contempt proceedings for not abiding by court orders. '

*He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people, and eat out their substance.*

"See DOGE. See the new turbo-powered Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency. But there are no reports yet of masked and unidentified ICE agents who “eat out” the people’s “substance.”"

*He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures.*

"Trump ordered Marines and National Guard troops into Los Angeles, when there was no war or insurrection, without the consent of the state legislature and over the objection of the governor and local officials."

*For cutting off our Trade with all parts of the world:*

Trump proposed draconian global tariffs that in many cases would bring trade to a halt, claiming trade deficits with countries such as Lesotho were a national “emergency.”

*For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:*

Tariffs are taxes. Under the Constitution, Congress has the power to impose tariffs. There was no vote in Congress to approve these tariffs."

*"For depriving us in many cases, of the benefits of Trial by Jury:"*

"The Trump administration has rounded up Venezuelan migrants and sent them to an infamous Salvadoran prison without affording them due process or court hearings." 

*He has abdicated Government here, by declaring us out of his Protection and waging War against us.*

"He has abdicated his responsibility to protect Americans by [denying disaster relief](https://arkansasadvocate.com/2025/04/25/trump-denies-disaster-aid-tells-states-to-do-more/) to states, including Arkansas (tornadoes), North Carolina (a hurricane), West Virginia (flooding), and Washington (a windstorm).

As for “waging war,” Noem (see above) has threatened to use federal troops to take over Los Angeles. ICE agents have terrorized communities coast to coast, injuring residents. Detainees have died in ICE jails. "

*He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavored to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers, the merciless Indian Savages, whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions.*

"The second part of this grievance sounds like a comment Trump might post on Truth Social, but the first part is something he actually did—on January 6, 2021."

ChiGuy6124

But let’s face facts here, the Republicans don’t actually believe in ANY of these founding principles. They have been replaced by greed, corruption, and sheer incompetence.

RamonaQ-JunieB

I've been saying this for months. Like, just read the Declaration of Independence!

0002millertime

We need to counteract the propaganda machine by flooding people with a simplified version of exactly this comparison. Think about it. Wheatpasted on city walls and train stations and billboards. At least make them look at it

beadzy

I’m so glad someone finally did a write up comparing the two.  Months ago I was wondering if and when someone would make the connection and write about it.  The analogies are frightening similar

XI_Vanquish_IX

I mean I remember during his first term npr tweeted out the Declaration of Independence and right wingers freaked out cause they thought it was bout trump. Really telling on themselves.

FalstaffsGhost

We have the Virginia Gazette’s list of grievances hanging on the wall of my home. 

Every other week I get to check off another one. Fun times we are living in.

thethehead

williamgman

Remember this?:

https://apnews.com/general-news-united-states-government-45c9fd6838a8450a849d95ff7daefa34?utm_source=copy&amp;utm_medium=share

road_chewer

[John Adams wrote that approximately one-third of the American population supported the move for independence (Patriots), one-third of the population supported the king (Loyalists), and one-third supported neither side (neutral).](https://www.nps.gov/teachers/classrooms/loyalists-in-american-revolution.htm#:~:text=John%20Adams%20wrote%20that%20approximately,supported%20neither%20side%20(neutral))

So the 1/3 that voted for Democrats may have to look to Washington for ideas on how to actually win

Adventurous-Bet9747

Don't forget 19:

"Transporting us beyond seas to be tried for pretended offenses."

BigDaddyCoolDeisel

Listed first: He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

John Roberts coming up with “absolute immunity” is the most ludicrous opinion in US Supreme Court history

Choppergold

Sounds like we have the perfect new posters to wheat paste everywhere

Here is the updated version.


The history of the ~~present King of Great Britain~~ self-anointed King of the United States is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

He has ~~forbidden his~~ obstructed our state Governors to pass Laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them.

He has refused to pass other Laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of ~~Representation in the Legislature~~  equal representation, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.

He has ~~called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public Records~~ issued a virtual barrage of executive orders, for the sole purpose of fatiguing ~~them~~ his opposition into compliance with his measures.

He has dissolved ~~Representative Houses~~ essential government agencies repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.

He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be ~~elected~~ established; whereby the ~~Legislative~~ agency powers, incapable of Annihilation, have returned to the People at large for their exercise; the State[s] remaining in the mean time exposed to all the dangers of ~~invasion~~ destruction from without, and convulsions within.

He has endeavoured to prevent the ~~population of~~ immigration to these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither, and raising the conditions of ~~new Appropriations of Lands~~ prosperity.

He has ~~obstructed~~ corrupted the Administration of Justice, by refusing his Assent to Laws ~~for establishing~~ of established Judiciary ~~powers~~ precedent.

He has made Judges dependent on his Will alone, for the ~~tenure~~ confirmation of their offices, and the amount and payment ~~of~~ for their ~~salaries~~ endorsements.

He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of ~~Officers~~ unqualified hacks to harrass our people, and eat out their substance.

He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our ~~legislatures~~ state administrators.

He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power.

He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation:

For Quartering large bodies of armed ~~troops~~ goons among us:

For protecting them, by ~~a mock Trial~~ dismissing complaints, from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:

For ~~cutting off~~ limiting our Trade with all parts of the world:

For imposing ~~Taxes~~ tariffs on us without our Consent:

For depriving us in many cases, of the benefits of Trial by Jury:

For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offences:

For ~~abolishing~~ the free System of English Laws in a neighbouring ~~Province~~ Country, establishing therein ~~an Arbitrary~~  a subservient government, and ~~enlarging~~ enveloping its Boundaries so as to render it at once an example and fit instrument for ~~introducing~~ imposing the same absolute rule ~~into~~ on these ~~Colonies~~ Provinces:

For taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws, and altering fundamentally the Forms of our Governments:

For ~~suspending~~ corrupting our own Legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever.

He has abdicated Government here, by declaring us out of his Protection and waging War against us.

He has plundered our ~~seas~~ rights, ravaged our ~~Coasts~~ health care, ~~burnt~~ divided our towns, and destroyed the lives of our people.

He is at this time transporting large ~~Armies of foreign Mercenaries~~ shipments of arms to Israel to compleat the works of death, desolation and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty &amp; perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation.

He has constrained our fellow Citizens taken Captive ~~on the high Seas~~ by hive mentality to bear Arms against their Country, to become the executioners of their friends and Brethren, or to fall themselves by their Hands.

He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavoured to bring on the inhabitants of our ~~frontiers~~ boondocks, the mindless MAGATs, whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions.

nwgdad

MAGAs should trade that red hat for a red coat. They don’t deserve to call themselves “patriots.”

JarJarJarMartin

On 16APR2025 i asked ChatGPT the following: "Rewrite the declaration of independence tailored to the crimes and misdeeds of President Donald Trump using the media coverage from the last 10 years instead of King George.". I did it as a lark over my morning coffee ha ha this will be funny. As i read through the result i was amazed at the restraint (indifference?) of my fellow citizens. I hope this gets spread wide because by the end of it i wasnt laughing anymore.

ceiffhikare

I taught this document for years, and am delighted someone ha noticed this. It closes by saying we warned the Brits that the king was abusing us, to no avail. It concludes by saying “playtime is over, now comes revolution.” 

How about that?

killerwithasharpie

With the 4th coming up tomorrow, the same idea of laying out that comparison had occurred to me.  Looks like Mother Jones has saved me that work.  

I had also come across a reddit post from a month ago with similar (and a few extra) current actions that line up: [https://www.reddit.com/r/esist/comments/1koyx30/how\_much\_of\_the\_declaration\_of\_independence/](https://www.reddit.com/r/esist/comments/1koyx30/how_much_of_the_declaration_of_independence/)

sciguyC0

Pretty sure he wanted the Declaration of Independence in the Oval Office so he could "fix" it with a sharpie.

bytemage

yeah tubz got done with the ten commandments a while ago, needs a new shitbag quest

hurdurBoop

Jeffries said he might read it later on, ‘on the record’ because he’s ’taking his own sweet time’

popsy13

Well, if the ICE Agents pick any produce from the fields during their roundups that would be the "eating out," of other peoples, "substances."

_MrBalls_

1. He has imposed tariffs upon us without the consent of our representatives, burdening our commerce and prosperity.

2. He has waged war against foreign nations without the authority of Congress, endangering our peace and security.

3. He has sought to undermine the independence of the judiciary, making judges beholden to his will.

4. He has attacked the free press, labeling dissenting voices as "fake news" and undermining the foundation of our democracy.

5. He has disregarded the rule of law, acting in ways that threaten the very principles upon which our nation was founded.

6. He has used the powers of the presidency to enrich himself and his enterprises, violating the trust placed in him by the people.

7. He has separated families at our borders, inflicting suffering upon innocent children and their parents.

8. He has rolled back protections for our environment, endangering the health and safety of our citizens.

9. He has ignored the counsel of science, dismissing evidence that threatens his agenda and the welfare of the public.

10. He has sought to dismantle our healthcare system, jeopardizing the well-being of millions of Americans.

11. He has enacted policies that discriminate against marginalized communities, undermining the rights of the vulnerable.

12. He has incited violence against peaceful protesters, fostering a climate of fear and division among our people.

13. He has undermined the integrity of our democratic institutions, casting doubt upon the legitimacy of our elections.

14. He has dismissed and removed officials for political reasons, compromising the integrity of our government.

15. He has interfered with investigations that seek to hold him accountable, obstructing justice and accountability.

16. He has propagated falsehoods and conspiracy theories, eroding public trust in our institutions.

17. He has withdrawn from international agreements, isolating our nation and undermining global cooperation.

18. He has alienated our allies while embracing adversarial regimes, jeopardizing our national security.

19. He has sought to limit the operations of the U.S. Postal Service, threatening the integrity of our electoral process.

20. He has fostered division and hatred among our citizens, undermining the unity that is essential for our democracy.

21. He has neglected the COVID-19 pandemic, failing to protect the health and safety of the American people.

22. He has enacted policies that undermine workers' rights, eroding the protections that safeguard our labor force.

23. He has cut funding for public education, jeopardizing the future of our children and the prosperity of our nation.

24. He has spread misinformation, creating confusion and distrust among the populace.

25. He has attacked the integrity of our electoral process, claiming widespread fraud without evidence.

26. He has rolled back civil rights protections, endangering the liberties of countless individuals.

27. He has declared war upon the very principles of democracy, seeking to silence dissent and undermine our freedoms.

thedraggingdragon

al_ien5000

Just an FYI to the left...the Revolution kicked off because the Crown was engaged in gun control.

Polar_Bear_1234


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In other words governor/president can hold elected representatives to ransom by not passing bills, is that what they want ?

-Divided_We_Stand

This govt is quasi autocratic, they don’t let other govt work so that they can score political brownies against them , and when other parties calls them out , they start to cry and ends up calling them against the federalism or idea of India . We have a petty leader as prime minister and evil party bjp ruling us. For that party , only electoral win matters , they have already sold national interest to fucking Adani

[deleted]

Bol wo rahi hai lekin shabd kisi aur ke hai

GoodAd5004

charavaka

A 3 month timeline to reject a bill or pass a bill, should be enough time. What is the debate in this issue? 

Can someone make a rumour that the Governor post is created by British Rule and they are still working for the British. So that our beloved RSS teams and co., will go and destroy their Bhavans.

ForzaFerrari7

Supreme leader ne bola to inhone puch liya

GlitteringWafer9263

https://x.com/mkstalin/status/1922908484372398116

I strongly condemn the Union Government’s Presidential reference, which attempts to subvert the Constitutional position already settled by the Hon’ble Supreme Court in the Tamil Nadu Governor’s case and other precedents. This attempt clearly exposes the fact that the Tamil Nadu Governor acted at the BJP’s behest to undermine the people’s mandate. This is nothing but a desperate attempt to weaken democratically elected State Governments by placing them under the control of Governors serving as agents of the Union Government. It also directly challenges the majesty of law and the authority of the Supreme Court as the final interpreter of the Constitution.
Why should there be any objection to prescribing time limits for Governors to act? Is the BJP seeking to legitimise its Governors’ obstruction by allowing indefinite delays in Bill assent? Does the Union Government intend to paralyse non-BJP State Legislatures? Our nation stands at a critical juncture. The questions raised in the reference reveal the BJP-led Union Government’s sinister intent to distort the Constitution’s basic distribution of powers and incapacitate the State Legislatures dominated by opposition parties. Thus, it poses a clear exigent threat to State autonomy. In these grave circumstances, I urge all non-BJP States and party leaders to join this legal struggle to defend the #Constitution. We will fight this battle with all our might.

frizene26

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CurIns9211

The principle of "reasonable time" when no specific time limit is prescribed in the Constitution or a law is related to the doctrine of legitimate expectation.


 This doctrine, while not explicitly mentioned in the Constitution, is often applied within the framework of Article 14 (equality before the law and equal protection of the laws) and ensures fairness and non-arbitrariness in government actions. 


This doctrine acknowledges that legislature can have valid expectations based on Governor actions or policies, even if these expectations are not explicitly enshrined in law. These expectations can arise from promises made by public authorities, established practices, or consistent past actions.



When a time limit is not explicitly set, "reasonable time" is implied. This means the Governor must act within a period that is deemed appropriate given the circumstances, considering fairness and the specific situation.


Relationship with Article 14:
The doctrine of legitimate expectation is closely linked to Article 14, which guarantees equality and non-arbitrariness in governmentGovernor actions. If the Governor fails to act within a reasonable time or violates a legitimate expectation, it could be considered a breach of Article 14.


This is a line of advice the SC can give. 

Legislature can have legitimate expectations of the Governor (head of executive branch) and by extention expectations can be about  "reasonable time" for exercise of the administrative actions by Governor as head of executive branch. 
However my only doubt is does Legislature (as a branch of Government) have Article 14 protection under the Constitution against Governor (executive branch)?

Sudden-Check-9634

&gt; The reference also sought to know; whether “in light of the constitutional scheme governing the powers of the President, is the President required to seek advice of the Supreme Court by way of a reference under Article 143 of the Constitution of India and take the opinion of the Supreme Court when the Governor reserves a Bill for the President’s assent or otherwise?”

&gt; “Are the decisions of the Governor and the President under Article 200 and Article 201 of the Constitution of India, respectively, justiciable at a stage anterior into the law coming into force? Is it permissible for the Courts to undertake judicial adjudication over the contents of a Bill, in any manner, before it becomes law?” and “can the exercise of constitutional powers and the orders of/by the President / Governor be substituted in any manner under Article 142 of the Constitution of India?”

tryst_of_gilgamesh

&gt; With the Supreme Court setting timelines for the President and Governors to act on Bills sent by state assemblies, President Droupadi Murmu has sought the top court’s opinion under Article 143(1) on whether their actions are justiciable and whether such timelines can be imposed on them in the absence of any such provision in the Constitution.

Translation. Does supreme court have in authority to question us while we use governor for political motives and to claw back state govt under opposition. 

Bjp literally is doing what congress did in the 80's

BloodwarFTW

Engineers also need 1000 years to build a bridge just like you, Madam President.

Why so lazy?

If you take money from our tax money, work for our benefit. Else, I don't see the use of overpaid posts.

adityaguru149

The Supreme Court of India is deliberating on a Presidential Reference regarding the authority of Governors in granting assent to state assembly bills, highlighting tensions between opposition-led states and their Governors.

Supreme Court Presidential Reference on Governor Assent to Bills

Why This Matters

Public Sentiment Summary

Highlighted Comments

Parties Involved

What the people want