Public opinion on Iran's nuclear program and sanctions is highly polarized, with strong nationalistic support for Iran coexisting alongside significant critiques of its human rights record and accusations of supporting terrorism. Many commenters view the sanctions as unjust and ineffective, exacerbating tensions and causing harm to the Iranian populace.

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The United Nations Security Council has failed to adopt the draft resolution that would give continued sanctions relief for Iran as per the JCPOA

This means that SnapBack has now been officially activated, and UN sanctions against Iran will take effect at 8pm on September 27th.

aWhiteWildLion

If China and Russia don’t respect the resolution (as they’ve suggested they’re not going to) then I’m not sure what this actually does. I guess it was “use it or lose it” situation. 

kindagoodatthis

Iran bots jumped on this thread immediately.

This actions shows that while the general population on the West might be confused, as least a critical mass of politicians still know what’s going on.

The real question is what kinds of measures, covert or otherwise, are being used to ensure compliance?

Honestly, I just pity the poor Iranians. Shia Muslims aren’t even a majority, and it must be maddening to see your government destroy your place in the world, and your own economy, by spending g tax dollars on nuclear facilities that will just get bombed in a few years. And I can’t say that if I lived there I’d have the courage to revolt. The violence that suppers the system is terrifying.

ADP_God

TheWolfofBinance

Nuclear non proliferation no longer makes sense. The greatest stabilizer to international relations is wmds. We should be criticizing Iran for a lot, such as human rights abuses, sponsoring terrorism, supporting Ukraine war off aggression etc. The list is long. I support sanctioning them for all sorts of reasons, but not for wanting to be a country. 

Any country who wants to be a country, who's conventional military is not the best in the world, and who has even one adversary, needs wmds. I want canada to have a chemical weapons program. Let's sanction them for an actual good reason, on an issue that they may budge on.

gooberfishie

Illegal snapback, invalid under UN law since the US quit JCPOA in 2018. They leave a deal and still trigger its rights. Besides, after 18th Oct, Resolution 2231 expires so only western unilateral sanctions remain, not UN law. Too bad, China and Russia will continue to do business with Iran as usual.

God bless Ayatollah Sayed Ali Khamenei, his wisdom and strength. If reformists like Zarif, Rafsanjani &amp; Rouhano got their way with a JCPOA 2, Iran would not even have any missiles today to respond to Israeli terrorism.

PracticalBook8901

https://preview.redd.it/vp7a7u7idn7f1.png?width=1080&amp;format=png&amp;auto=webp&amp;s=efd40bbe36350328078415f600460db11c684bef

5ma5her7

&gt; The success of the first nuclear deal being undone by Trump doesn't mean that America could never make a similar agreement with Iran but there doesn't even seem to be any interest in that

Actually, I think it does. Why would Iran, a historic enemy of the American right, trust that the American right doesn't take power again and rips up any deal they did previously? Trump did USMCA and then ripped that up the first day in office

qchisq

I mean, they literally elected Trump again. Americans are veritably r-worded.

[deleted]

Explaining anything about the first deal to anyone that voted for trump is a waste of time, trump already said that was a bad deal, nuff said

soaps678

Sometimes I hate you europosters

Nobody forgot about negotiation, especially the Iran deal. Do you honestly expect Trump, the reality we live under, to negotiate another Iran deal?

Of course negotiating would be great but it’s not viable rn
so why discuss it?

makesmashgreatagain

From the podcasts I listened to this morning, Trump was genuinely trying to strike a new deal with Iran where Iran would give up uranium enrichment but not its civilian nuclear program by agreeing to buy enriched uranium from other countries. The Ayatollah declared 2 weeks ago that they would never give up enrichment  under any circumstances and that's when Trump got pissed. He had given Iran a 60-day deadline (pushed by Israel) and day 61, Israel launched with quiet support from Trump, and now that it seems to be going very well, spoken support. So here we are.  I don't think Trump has no interest in diplomacy, he just has his chaotic, bullying, imperial toddler-like take on it. I hope he's successful in bullying Iran into a deal for the sake of world peace but I fear that if he is, we can expect MAGA to eat off it at the ballot box for the next couple decades. 

Yes Trump was dumb to tear up the JCPOA in the first place.

toccobrator

Didn't the IAEA constantly admonish Iran for obfuscating, lying and withholding? Agreements only have value if both parties respect them.

EconomyDue2459

Are you seriously mentioning diplomacy with the current administration? Iran doesn’t want an off-ramp just how Russia doesn’t want an off-ramp. They both know that US is weak and wont do anything. Trump in office makes the US more unpredictable but even that hasn’t stopped Putin from making a complete mockery of US.

themokah

Ok but how do you convince a country, that has Israeli genocide as their long term goal, to not build nukes?

The JCPOA, which Iran broke, is limited to 2030 anyways at which point Iran would be able to build nukes legally. It was never a long term solution in the first place. 

I think as long as you have a regime in place that wants to murder Jews &amp; westerners simply for existing, you cannot have a peaceful solution to this. Not everything can be solved by diplomacy. 

For context: I am german. If the US had not stepped in militarily we would probably be forced to recite the first page of Mein Kampf on a daily basis. They came and denazified us, got rid of all the bad ideologies and helped us reach new levels of prosperity. Imo this should be the blueprint of dealing with foreign nations who are radicalized beyond healthy reasoning.

SpaceRac1st

i mean of all the things the president has the power to do single handedly, its fuck up foreign policy. This is the category "the people" have the least power over the president in, so what people think rn isnt terribly relevant.

AnodurRose98

JCPOA provided preferential treatment to a known bad actor and sent the wrong message globally regarding non-proliferation, namely “If you break your obligations under NPT and make progress toward nuclear weapons using technology that was freely given to you via NPT, don’t worry about it, just call up the USA and make a deal to stop doing the things you already promised to never do and big daddy America will unground you and give you back your allowance.”

marchian

Military intervention is good if it works.  I'm happy to let Trump ruin his coalition and set back the Iranian atomic program with a convenient scapegoat if it doesn't work.  In my opinion, it's a risk either way.  Potential really good outcomes and potentially decently bad ones as well.

Dude_Nobody_Cares

Did you forget Biden was trying to revive the JCPOA, or a different NPT style agreement?

backupya

Americans will have forgotten about Mike Lee's tweet in a week even though he should resign in shame. 

Politicians just have to give it a few days for the news cycles to change a couple of times and they get magically forgiven.

omgitsdot

Haha

Let’s trust the guys who chant death to America as a mantra at every major event. They’ll definitely stick to their side of the deal.

You guys are so dumb on this sub.

Potatoes90

The issue I have is what it would take for Iran to come back for discussion, for a deal….

At this point both sides are interested in more escalation than backing down

Upset-Review-3613

Because Iran was never intending to follow the spirit of the agreement, it was just meant to buy them time to reach the bomb.

BabaleRed

If I were a Middle Eastern country, I’d be digging a huge ass bunker under any mountain I can find now.

For purposes of intellectual peaceful research of course.

Yes. They forgot about the deal. 

Remember this is the art of the deal president, known for making new deals on his terms….

Like…. Uhhh….

Hold on.

Status_Fox_1474

I posted on here pointing out that israel encouraged trump to leave the deal and i got a bunch of steelmans of the israel position about how the iran deal was too weak because it didnt stop them enriching uranium entirely, and its better to reintroduce sanctions in the hope their population will rise up against them, and just hope they can bomb whatever nuclear facilities they end up building. They did it tbf, but israelis have died in the process, as have many innocent iranians who happen to live in the same tower blocks as nuclear scientists.

Party_Judge6949

Diplomacy is the shitter. As you pointed out, we did have a deal going before Trump removed us from it but even that was an agreement to inspections. What halted their development were assurances that they wouldn’t need them as a deterrent. They could rely instead on conventional balistics and their proxies to soak retaliation. It’d also be more trouble than its worth with major economic powers breathing down their neck. Recent escalations however have led them to conclude if they don’t want their adversaries treading on them (assassinating their generals as was done by Trump in the first term) they need bigger guns. 

If a diplomatic solution is possible, it ain’t gonna be Trump to do it. Hopefully it can be done inspite of him. Ain’t no reason for Iran to expect any deals he make to stick given his instability and history of reneging on international agreements. 

Best case scenario, the US maintains passive involvement and Israel handles it on largely on their own while aircraft carriers provide morale support.

DandyElLione

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 *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev/home)*

Yeah te deal was good and the EU tried to keep it alive, but once Trump killed it Iran decided to enrich again.  
We are now 8 years later at a point where Iran is apparently quite close to nukes and added onto it, Trump will neve be able to reach any deal whatsoever.  
We have Israel wanting to kill every mullah possible and Trump completely lost in this whole mess.

Dimplomacy was used and it could have succeded, but america elected an orange clown twice.  
You might blame biden for doing nothing about it, but honestly he had a lot of other shit to handle and had probably no political capital left ot get into any agreement with Iran.

Meanwhile Iran also radicalised itself more.  
The IRGC got more radical and Trump had Suleimani killed.

There is no more diplomacy left here, nobody actually wants it and as shit as it is, Netanyahu got what he wanted a military solution to the Iranian nuclear threat.

As far as I am concerned, Iran not getting a nuclear warhead is good, the way we get there now is probably only airstirkes, but I do agree that diplomany could have been a much better alternative.

Athasos

The first Iran nuclear deal was under Obama where they agreed to come up with a nuclear deal. Obviously, it has since been scrapped. 

Moonagi

Wait who did the nuclear deal? Obama? 
That’s the start and end of it.

Seven_pile

I mean are you saying that if the US fully dedicates itself to destroying their nuclear facilities somehow they’ll be able to build a low key one and keep the development going? That sounds unlikely aren’t they pretty massive facilities

PastaKingFourth

The negotiations wouldn't have gone anywhere, since they are already close they probably thought they could secure some nuclear weapons before anything concrete is agreed on, and by that point it would already be too late. I could be speaking out of my ass but I heard the Iranians seemed to be just stalling

H20memes

\&gt; compared to a war which will at best destroy current Iranian development

At best, this will destroy the current Iranian government, and it can be replaced with either a shah or a liberal democracy. In that case, they'll love to make a deal with the US that protects them from both outside and inside threats. 

I don't think that's a likely outcome, but I can understand people who view it like that.

PM_ME_CRYPTOKITTIES

Could I ask you why you think Iran would make another deal with a country that rescinds the previous deal in less than 2 years?

DeathandGrim

Do we have a good idea if the Iranian regime was adhering to the Obama nuclear deal or not?

runescapelover12

American voted for Trump, there is nothing long term here. 

At certain point, for me it’s not about America, it’s about Iranian people to seize the opportunity of chaos to leverage a better life for themselves 

Spirited-Willow-2768

Left_ctrl

I'm just curious in how it was not a terrible deal? We let Iran use the threats of nukes to normalize its country in international trade and free up billions they could use for war.

Surely55

Because Iran wasn't willing to make a new deal and was already in violation of its non-proliferation treaty obligations. They explicitly stated that any limits on uranium enrichment were a red line and the talks weren't going anywhere. This would only be the case if you want to be able to make a nuke. Repeating this point is just as regarded as Trump's "they should just make a deal" when talking about Ukraine.

BigFatBallsInMyMouth

Reminder that Iran admitted to cheating the JCPOA.

https://www.memri.org/tv/iranian-atomic-energy-chief-ali-akbar-salehi-secret-purchase-nuclear-tubes-jcpoa-destroy-yellowcake-propulsion-arak-reactor

strl

This idea about negotiating away from nukes makes some sense. However, there is a serious question we need to address first; Why does the Iranian regime keep saying they want to destroy Israel so badly? If the Ayatollah left Israel alone, there is no physical risk of Israel encroaching on its borders or stealing its resources. Their moves have had significant economic and military consequences so much so it goes beyond any other moral backing of Palestinians in any other country.
I feel like this has something to do with consolidating a religious power/authority as the only Muslim nation left to destroy the Jewish State which, in their mind, was supposed to be Palestine. I know Shia and Sunni Muslims have been at it for ages so, with Iran being Shia, I feel they want to gain legitimacy in the eyes of other Muslims so they don't get attacked by the more popular Sunnis.

I found this article here it kind of backs up my claim but they use a vague term "grow regional influence". Why is destroying Israel so vital for that goal and why is it so important? https://www.dw.com/en/iran-israel-attacks-hezbollah-ayatollah-ali-khamenei-islamic-revolution/a-68780605

How much is the Iranian regime willing to sacrifice for this regional influence and make nukes anyway under the guise of a nuclear deal so it can destroy Israel with even more impunity?

Diolan

No. They just see that it was pushed by Obama therefore it was a bad deal and trump HAD to get rid of it with no chance of nuance

Ungobundo222

I think this is were the ‘neocon’ war hawks come from. Throughout the 2000’s the conversation was around Iran getting nukes and how the US stops it. Diplomacy wasn’t talked about as a solution (and if there is diplomacy then they’re secretly building nukes).

blockedcontractor

Iran has not complied with any agreement regardless of which administration it was under. That's the problem.

DJQuadv3

Exactly, it’s so weird seeing so many people in this community, who we all know are not in the military, cheering on the US getting even more involved. This community has had its head wrapped by all the I/P stuff that many here will never recover from. It’s gross and shows exactly why this country is like this cause even people who are supposedly in opposition to Trump are going full steam ahead with supporting trumps escalation of the situation. Just gross

CautiousKenny

I know, this community can be crazy sometimes.

I agree a war with Iran is not an option!!! People don't think about the consequences.

You would have an immigration flow into Europe. It would turn Europe into a fascist continent. It would hurt so many people all around the world and would destabilize the region even more, ...

This isn't something we want. At least not something I want.

Also, this is the best reason for Iran to seek nuclear weapons! Actions like these justify nukes.

Imminent danger doesn't mean years in international law. And you aren't responsible for groups you support if you don't control them directly. That's international law.

Both sides have supported militias. Israel has supported Kurdish militias and Iran Shia militias. But do they have direct control? That would be interesting to know.

I doubt it, because otherwise Hezbollah and Hamas would have attacked Israel, when Israel bombarded Iran. So it's probably just money and weapons. In that case, Israel did the same.

Additionally, Israel already has nukes. I never understand how people can ignore things like that.

Silent-Cap8071

They've been weeks away from nuclear weapons for the past 20 years lmao

KormetDerFrag

Ah I see so the Iranians 100% complied with the nuclear deal which was in place. This was then unilaterally ended by Trump and now the Europeans are of course eagerly following in the footsteps of their two daddies.

MaulanaTatt

Is there another country in the region that has nuclear weapons in flagrant violation of international law?

pecuchet

Ah wait, I thought Trump had completely destroyed them?

/s

giro83

What is origin of the obsession with Iran?

What business do these 3 European countries have in the Middle East with Iran?

English_linguist

It’s been really great watching the reforming of E3. Getting the boys back together.

Reassuring to know Brexit wasn’t the end of relationships like this.

GuyLookingForPorn

Unfortunately Israel's actions this year will have shown Iran that the protection offered it by being part of the western diplomatic process is not good enough, and they need a credible physical deterrent to prevent Israeli aggression. No-one's invading North Korea or Pakistan.

And they are quite rightly very suspicious that the 'inspectors' included Israeli spies that gave Israel valuable intel for attacking these nuclear sites.

Astriania

So are we doing anything about Israel for the past 2 years or were we too busy being lobbied and its convieniently inconvinient to do so.

thesosig

What’s the tally now for “they’re a week away from nuclear weapons” over the last 20+ years?

Teedeous

Not the other country in middle east which started in 1948

Relative-Chain73

We should bring Iran in from the cold.

Cheap oil/gas and big demand for our Financial Services, EU manufactured goods etc. costs Russia/China an ally. And frankly we have more in common with them than Israel or Saudi.

It just takes someone to do it…

Sea-Caterpillar-255

Only if there was some sort of nuclear deal that could be made, oh wait

SergeantButtNaked

Why were they even lifted in the first place? Lifting those sanctions would've helped them to no end

Inglorious555

Why were the sanctions removed anyway?  Ridiculous.  They’re not our friends, they never will  be.  Just build a huge wall around them with just one door. Let out all those who want to leave and throw in all the despots who want to support their regime, close the door and let them get on with it.

Positive_Caramel2525

Why do we need Western/large economy exceptionalism with regards to nuclear weapons? Every nation state either shouldn't have them, or should be allowed them.

technurse

They're flagrantly breaching the terms of the agreement while still being parties to it.  How can they talk about fair negotiations when they don't even stick to what they've agreed?

Tetracropolis

Iran has no leg to demand anything. Its nuclear facilities are destroyed and under surveillance. Any attempt to build its nuclear capabilities, I believe, will be bombed again. Therefore, it is better for Iran to refrain from chaos.

Abdulkarim0

The whole situation feels like a bad rerun of the last decade. Iran says it is ready for fair talks if the West shows goodwill but at the same time the Europeans pull the snapback lever knowing full well that Tehran sees it as illegitimate. It is hard to call it diplomacy when both sides are already digging trenches. The US and Israel literally bombed Iranian facilities two months ago and now the E3 expects Iran to sit politely at a negotiation table. Of course Iran is going to call out the legal basis because that is the only card they have left besides escalation. What is striking is how little faith there is on either side that talks could actually solve anything. 

The snapback mechanism was always a blunt tool and using it now just looks like desperation to lock in sanctions before the October deadline. Ordinary people in Iran will pay the price in higher costs and more isolation while politicians in Europe and Washington pat themselves on the back for being tough.

UnlikelyOpposite7478

Every time, the western countries falling for the bullshit of a fanatic islamist mafia that holds the country of Iran hostage, posing as a "government" while spreading terrorism, death and decay internally and externally, not to mention being famous for their hostage diplomacy ever since they came to power with western help in 1979. 

When will it end? When will these spineless European countries stop appeasing these islamists?

DonnieB555

&gt; *“It is not as though if they activate snapback, we will die.”* 

said Iranian President Masoud Pezeshkian

kaneki_uzumaki20

The UN Security Council has rejected a last-minute proposal from Russia and China to delay the reimposition of sanctions on Iran over its nuclear program.

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